Surgical style - what difference do it make?

The final frontier. Deciding when, if and how.

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newbie443
Posts: 432
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:41 pm
Location: Sedgwick county, Kansas USA

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby newbie443 » Wed May 08, 2019 8:37 pm

FMLFML85 wrote:I could not get dr Kramer to schedule at this time because he is moving to a new office.... so I will se dr Eid in June for a consultation. Still haven’t been able to pin down my insurance company as to wether I’m covered or not. Do any of you know how much more expensive dr Eid is? I have Blue plus metro ppo, would any of you know if they cover this procedure?


First, insurance is state controlled. I have Kansas BCBS Gold plan. I do have coverage for this if caused by physical damage. But only if I go to a BCBS network doctor in part of my state. And BCBS must approve this prior to surgery. That is why I had to pay out of pocket to go to my doctor. You will need to read your insurance policy to find out. I buy my insurance from BCBS and it is the same policy BCBS provides for the Affordable Care Act (AKA OBama care). My state has 3 levels of plans. Bronze, Silver, and Gold. Insurance through a work place can be different also. And as I said states control this so things can be different state to state. You could ask the doctors business office to find out for you.

Kramer was 24K when I went to see him but that did not cover the surgery fitness certification. I went to my GP doctor for that. That covered a 1/2 hour office visit with Kramer and the surgery, then a Friday hotel visit. I am not sure what Eid charges but I think it is around 27K. Eid dose testing that Kramer did not do with me.
Injections failed. Implanted 3-21-18 AMS 700 LGX 21 + 1 RTE 100 cc reservoir Dr. Kramer. https://youtu.be/QPu9pLBM0wM

62 years young.

Will show and tell and talk with others.

newbie443
Posts: 432
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:41 pm
Location: Sedgwick county, Kansas USA

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby newbie443 » Wed May 08, 2019 9:05 pm

Larry10625 wrote:
newbie443 wrote:
Larry10625 wrote:

He REFUSED to see you? Does he know that there are problems? Is this just a secretary stating his usual wishes and does not know the whole story? WOW... Busy or not, that is NOT good. Most surgeons do not like going in on someone else's work. Fingers crossed for the three years but I would keep bugging him until he saw you, or keep looking for a surgeon to fix what is wrong. Try asking AMS for advice or to refer you to a GOOD surgeon who is close and will see you after another doctors has been slicing and dicing. :)

Larry


I have all my e-mails saved to and from him advising him of my problems and his refusal to see me. This started when I was in Baltimore after his Friday visit to my hotel room. I had prepared in case of problems and had a flight leaving on Monday instead of the prior Saturday. I even had flight insurance and could have move my return to later that week. The e-mail to him advised him of this as well as my first problem. Most likely this was correct in that there was nothing that could be done at that time and all that could be done is wait and see how it all worked out. When I am able to have a revision I will start a new search for a surgeon but not just one that can replace a device that has failed. I need one like yours that can repair some damage.



You are very right... I managed to get two of the most talented surgeons in North America in the same OR at the same time. All you have to do is read the story and look at the pictures. I hope that you get the same amount of talent in your OR... nobody deserves this hell that we go through. :)

Larry


I could look at it that way. While I do wish things were perfect and pain free I can make women happy with it. I can have that part of me back again. Had I not done it I would still be in that real hell of ED. Nothing I can do that will change the past. All I can do is stay positive and keep going forward.
Injections failed. Implanted 3-21-18 AMS 700 LGX 21 + 1 RTE 100 cc reservoir Dr. Kramer. https://youtu.be/QPu9pLBM0wM

62 years young.

Will show and tell and talk with others.

Larry10625

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Larry10625 » Thu May 09, 2019 4:47 am

newbie443 wrote:
FMLFML85 wrote:These are the two I want the surgery from so scroll past this post if you don’t like it.

I had way less than perfect results from my doc in my signature. Not sure who I will go to for my revision when I am able to afford it. Thing is I was unlucky enough to have some problems. And my doc refused to see me about them until weeks later after I received a partial fix by an AMS rep. If that fix to my second problem had happened 3 weeks earlier things may have been a bit better. My problems involve my pump and my cylinders inflating differently. It is a long story but I have the saved e-mails of this from him plus there is a thread on this site of the second problem where in his e-mail he stated he had no idea what to do as he never had this problem with anyone who lasted as long as mine did. He did call me after that thread was posted and finally offered to see me changing his statement in the e-mail that he could fix it in his office in a very short time. Some damage had already been done and I had already had the partial fix by the AMS rep and did not fly back to see him as I was unable to do so by then.

Thing is I have no one anywhere close to where I live that my insurance will pay that I trust to do anything related to this. So I had to travel to have this done. For me I think I made the right choice to go to a doc with a good reputation for this. I was just unlucky to get a device that does not work properly. I could only afford one attempt at this as I paid out of pocket for this and it will be a few years before I can afford to try again. Even after the problems I still have something that works mostly and feel much better than I did before this surgery. Albeit not the perfect or near perfect outcome I had paid for and expected.

Bottom line to my post is that no one is perfect. It is difficult for follow up over the phone or e-mails. Much easier if you have a very good doc close to you IF problems occur. And much easier to get back in to see your doc. Both of these doc's are very good. Your chances of an as perfect outcome as you can have is very high with each of them. But there are others across the US and the world that are very good also. I would choose a local very good doc for the follow up care if that option was available to me. It was not, and I still think I made a good choice. Just keep in mind that all doc's have revision rates and it is possible that something will go wrong. Last time I checked Eid posted on his web site each of his patients with infection and the date. And devices malfunction and fail. Much better if you have someone local just in case. But if like me you don't then either one would be a good choice. As would be many others across the world.



What problems are you having? :)

Larry

Larry10625

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Larry10625 » Thu May 09, 2019 4:55 am

KMeister wrote:
danny1553 wrote:I have been watching surgery videos from both doctors. Well, obviously Dr. Kramer has more YouTube popularity due to numerous videos he has been posting. However, when watching techniques, it seems like Dr. Kramer is more… I do not even what word to pick, maybe more “elegant”.
When I watch how Dr. Kramer performs, it gives an illusion that it is easy. The way he moves his knife, he speaks and makes stitches; all looks very efficient and quick. While Dr. Eid does not create an impression that the surgery is a just a “piece of cake”. Other thing I noticed was that Dr. Kramer often used electric knife while Dr. Eid just the regular one. On the other hand, it seems like Dr. Eid tends to make smaller cuts and openings.

No doubt that both are the top world surgeons though. If I had a chance, I would not hesitate to go with either of them.

There's Kramer, there's Eid, yada, yada, yada.

It's big country. There are several skilled surgeons all across the country who can do an excellent job; probably a good half-dozen in California alone.

KMeister



The "electric knife" is used to cauterize vessels while they are cut to stop bleeding and therefore prevent bruising and therefore less swelling. :)

Larry

Larry10625

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Larry10625 » Thu May 09, 2019 5:01 am

strongagain wrote:
Do we have anyone who had a bad outcome with anyone of them?
I know two poor Kramer outcomes so far and yet none from Eid.


I know of one who was extremely unhappy with both of them - but I'm not supposed to give details.



Just out of curiosity, how did you come to know about the issue of both of them and how did it happen that somebody actually did use both of them? Feel free to answer in PM if you are more comfortable doing that. A lot of my communication on here now is PM because, frankly, I am tired of the drama. I thought all the drama was over when my three daughters left the nest to be with their spouses. :)

Larry

Larry10625

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Larry10625 » Thu May 09, 2019 5:08 am

palace01 wrote:I agree that most of the hype on here has been about Eid so it was good to read some about Kramer.
Also, a couple of things from Eid Lovers that I read and cringed about were, "spinal anaesthesia" and especially "several days with catheter".
And one other thing that I lack knowledge about.. Several Eid Lovers talk about him inserting longest possible implants, yet I read other posts about failure due to Erosion. Can somebody tell me whether Length and Erosion are related ?



After all of the reading I have done, members I have spoken with, PM's I have received, my telephone conversations I had with the big 4, Between Kramer and Eid, I would choose Kramer. One of the biggest reasons is the fact that Dr. Eid ONLY uses the Titan. Based on the fact that the market is 75% AMS for doctors selection, it concerns me that a surgeon wouldn't use both to ensure that the patient gets the one that is right for him. The Titan is NOT for everyone. :)

Larry

strongagain
Posts: 457
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:17 am

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby strongagain » Thu May 09, 2019 7:43 am

Larry10625 wrote:
I know of one who was extremely unhappy with both of them - but I'm not supposed to give details.


Just out of curiosity, how did you come to know about the issue of both of them and how did it happen that somebody actually did use both of them?


Hi Larry, I had received the infos via PM, three years ago. Unfortunately I can‘t remember the details, I deleted the PM. Should I remember the story, I gonna contact you.
67, ED since 2007 (colon cancer)
08 2015 Titan Zero Degree 22 cm + 3 cm RTE
Dr. Leiber, Freiburg, Germany
6.5" x 5.7" - Very happy with implant

Living in South Africa

DougAnd
Posts: 1152
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2018 5:10 pm
Location: Melbourne, Florida

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby DougAnd » Thu May 09, 2019 8:38 am

Newbie
Of course this news does not give me the confidence that I need but it is what it is. Given my other choices I'll stick with this one. I just wish us both the eventual best.

"Try asking AMS for advice or to refer you to a GOOD surgeon who is close and will see you after another doctors has been slicing and dicing. Larry"
Larry,
I don't mean to be disrespectful but I was talked out of going to Kramer twice and into going with my local guys by the AMS rep. We just had another brother who was referred to a "fine local surgeon" by his AMS rep with just as disastrous results. The last person on earth that I would ask is any rep.
That having been said my guys may have just had a bad day, and I unfortunately just happened to be it. What makes me angry is that they did not even see it as a problem. Still don't. I gave them the report of my distal crossover (which started out as corporal crossover ie the cylinders were not put in my corporas, they missed both sides) and the response was not a problem. I guess because it is common that makes it OK.
DougAnd
LGX 18cm+3cmRTE 8 / 8/18 by Docs Saracino , Prody of FL Disfigured by Implant. Married 31 years, Functionally impotent 2+ years. 4" day of surgery now 7" inflated. Pump moved 12/4/18 by Dr Kata Hopefully fixed by Dr Kramer 6/19/19

Frank Talk Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 513
Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 11:06 am
Location: NYC

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Frank Talk Admin » Thu May 09, 2019 8:49 am

Guys
Do you mind if we could come up with another name for this thread? First, I really do not want FT to be primarily a place for touting one doctor or comparing doctors. I was going to end this topic, but it has some benefits hidden in it. So, if the OP could find a new name that reflects what the discussion is about, that would be great.

Thanks
Paul

Larry10625

Re: Kramer Vs. Eid

Postby Larry10625 » Thu May 09, 2019 10:20 am

DougAnd wrote:Newbie
Of course this news does not give me the confidence that I need but it is what it is. Given my other choices I'll stick with this one. I just wish us both the eventual best.

"Try asking AMS for advice or to refer you to a GOOD surgeon who is close and will see you after another doctors has been slicing and dicing. Larry"
Larry,
I don't mean to be disrespectful but I was talked out of going to Kramer twice and into going with my local guys by the AMS rep. We just had another brother who was referred to a "fine local surgeon" by his AMS rep with just as disastrous results. The last person on earth that I would ask is any rep.
That having been said my guys may have just had a bad day, and I unfortunately just happened to be it. What makes me angry is that they did not even see it as a problem. Still don't. I gave them the report of my distal crossover (which started out as corporal crossover ie the cylinders were not put in my corporas, they missed both sides) and the response was not a problem. I guess because it is common that makes it OK.
DougAnd



Hey buddy, no disrespect taken. I have never heard of this about Dr. Kramer. Although Paul does not want Dr. bashing and I agree but there is nothing wrong with PM ing someone requested info, or even letting me know so that I can also advise people. Thanks for your info. For you and all, I will never take offence to respectful opinions that are not mind... it's when the tone or attitude becomes offensive or aggressive that I get upset. All of our seasoned veterans on here have a wealth of information to offer from either experience or research gathering over the days, months or years. A lot of what I know came from the interviews I had with the 4 surgeons. Although you had a poor experience with Dr. Kramer, I still think he is a great surgeon.... maybe he just needs to work on that side of his bedside manner :)

Larry


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